17 replies to this topic

[Guest_Jim_*]

This really is not much of an issue, but I thought it might be a good idea to let people know. I have noticed that if I run CCleaner then shortly thereafter tell my computer to shutdown my computer will get as far as everything on the desktop disappearing but with the wallpaper still up. It is what I would see if a program is refusing to shutdown and the computer is waiting for it, but it only happens after I run CCleaner and I do close CCleaner before I shutdown. If I just wait a little longer before trying to shutdown my computer, it shuts down fine with no problem.
Any ideas as to what could be causing this? Is it CCleaner directly doing it, or does the cleaning cause other programs to run immediately after. My OS is 32-bit Vista Ultimate if that helps.
Thank you.

[davey]

Guest_Jim_*, on Jul 25 2008, 11:16 AM, said:

This really is not much of an issue, but I thought it might be a good idea to let people know. I have noticed that if I run CCleaner then shortly thereafter tell my computer to shutdown my computer will get as far as everything on the desktop disappearing but with the wallpaper still up. It is what I would see if a program is refusing to shutdown and the computer is waiting for it, but it only happens after I run CCleaner and I do close CCleaner before I shutdown. If I just wait a little longer before trying to shutdown my computer, it shuts down fine with no problem.
Any ideas as to what could be causing this? Is it CCleaner directly doing it, or does the cleaning cause other programs to run immediately after. My OS is 32-bit Vista Ultimate if that helps.
Thank you.

Hi Jim.
Very Interesting . You have sharp observation skills.
Maybe your CPU is just too fast to notice in most cases but on mine that is standard procedure no matter what I just closed down.
You may be slipping into the old "newbie" syndrome also. CCleaner is the last thing I did so it must be doing it.
I think in this case it just might be attenuating the shutdown process just enough for you to notice what is standard for us with slower PCs less Ram what have you. In this case I don't think CCleaner is doing anything as much as adding to the things going on right at shutdown. Under other circumstances the virtual storage and cache whatever is released to some other process and you never even notice it.
I would have never known it, if you hadn't brought it up.
Sharp observation helps to identify many problems and therefore their solutions.
I get a nice clear view of my wallpaper at start-up as well as shutdown. Never thought of it as strange. Relativity!!!
Thanks Jim,
davey WinXP Pro SP3 Dell Dimension 2400 Pent 4 2.8Ghz 256 MB DDR RAM 333Mhz. Just enough to get by comfortably.

[Guest_Jim_*]

My processor is an AMD dual core Turion running at 2.2 Ghz, so I do not know if the speed is going to cause it, though I do have 2GB of RAM in it. I guess I did not explain it that well, my computer will go as far as the wallpaper and then stop and the only way to shut it down then is to do a hard shutdown, or possibly to wait a very long time. Also, this behavior only occurs after CCleaner is run immediately before shutdown, so there has to be a connection. To allow there to be a random event that occurs at the exact same time would be illogical, however I do fully grant that CCleaner may be causing another program to do something. Is it possible that a log file CCleaner deletes is immediately remade by something on the computer, thereby having to run and not allow a shutdown.
As an aside, my desktop is considerably slower than my laptop, which is what is having this problem, and I do notice and understand the wallpaper being up during shutdown, my laptop just gets stuck on it for a much, much longer time.

[Jamin4u]

Have a look in the Event Viewer to see if an application is hanging or something of that nature.

Jamin4u

[Guest_Jim_*]

The event viewer says that the previous shutdown was unexpected. Every time I have to do a hard shutdown I boot the computer back up and tell it to boot into Windows normally, so the next day I can start it up and leave it, this is probably why it says previous shutdown.
Two seconds after the unexpected shutdown message it gives this "Audit events have been dropped by the transport. The real time backup file was corrupt due to improper shutdown," but there is nothing from the actual shutdown, just after the next boot up.

[davey]

Guest_Jim_*, on Jul 26 2008, 09:52 AM, said:

My processor is an AMD dual core Turion running at 2.2 Ghz, so I do not know if the speed is going to cause it, though I do have 2GB of RAM in it. I guess I did not explain it that well, my computer will go as far as the wallpaper and then stop and the only way to shut it down then is to do a hard shutdown, or possibly to wait a very long time. Also, this behavior only occurs after CCleaner is run immediately before shutdown, so there has to be a connection. To allow there to be a random event that occurs at the exact same time would be illogical, however I do fully grant that CCleaner may be causing another program to do something. Is it possible that a log file CCleaner deletes is immediately remade by something on the computer, thereby having to run and not allow a shutdown.
As an aside, my desktop is considerably slower than my laptop, which is what is having this problem, and I do notice and understand the wallpaper being up during shutdown, my laptop just gets stuck on it for a much, much longer time.

What I thought was that the speed was hiding something that I normally see all the time. No, I don't think it is random event. I mean CCleaner's closing being relatively closer to shutdown is causing an event to occur that does not occur when not so close to shutdown. I don't think CCleaner itself is doing anything to cause the problem. I did not realize that it was actually stopping the shutdown.
Just remembered that you are Vista also so there are definite differences in shutdown processes as well.
I like Jamin4u suggestion also.
Of course, you are not doing any "secure deletion" are you ?
davey

[Jamin4u]

If you haven't already, I would look at the following category's in the Event Viewer.

1) Administrative Events
2) Application log
3) System log

Look for warnings and errors, before, during, and after shutdown.

Double click on events or logs for more info.

If you can't identify a cause, I would leave the proper amount of time between running CCleaner and shutdown to avoid the freeze.

I have 32-bit Vista Home Premium and can't duplicate the results.

Maybe someone with more experience can help you further.

Good Luck,

Jamin4u

[Guest_Jim_*]

No, I am not doing secure deletion and I do not believe it is CCleaner causing this directly either, just that it starts something that then blocks the shutdown.
I did look at as many of the logs as I could and those two events are the only ones that matched up with the shutdown, all the others had to do with starting up. Perhaps the reason you could not replicate this is that your CCleaner settings are different than mine. I have attached my CCleaner settings, though I did got through and remove the cookies, include and exclude stuff as I am certain none of those should have any relation to the problem.
 ccleaner.txt   2.55K   5 downloads

[DennisD]

I wonder if this little utility might help.

UPHClean:

Quote

UPHClean is a service that once and for all gets rid of problems with user
profile not unloading.

You are having profile unload problems if you experience slow logoff (with
Saving Settings for most of the time while logging off).

Many system and service processes do work on behalf of users. When the work
is done the system or service process is responsible for releasing handles it
has to the user profile hive. If this is not done by the service as the user
logs off the profile cannot be unloaded.

This problem in code can be caused by improper coding either in Microsoft
software or 3rd party software (e.g. printer drivers, virus scanner service,
etc). With the information provided by the system there is no way to find
out what software needs to be corrected to allow profiles to unload.

I was experiencing "hanging" and occasionally "slow shutdown" some time ago, and this useful little program was recommended, and certainly helped.

It might be worth a look.

[Jamin4u]

DennisD, The link you provided states: System Requirements
Supported Operating Systems: Windows 2000; Windows Server 2003; Windows XP.

Guest_Jim_* is using 32-bit Vista Ultimate.

I will keep this link for my XP system.

Thanks,

Jamin4u

[DennisD]

Sorry guys, my bad. There is some info on the functionality of UHPClean being inbuilt in Vista.

Vista and UPHClean:

[slowday444]

DennisD, on Jul 26 2008, 04:55 PM, said:

I wonder if this little utility might help.

UPHClean:



I was experiencing "hanging" and occasionally "slow shutdown" some time ago, and this useful little program was recommended, and certainly helped.

It might be worth a look.

First of all, so this doesn't fall under the domain of hijacking, let me say I shutdown without CCleaning and with CCleaning prior to shutdown and there was no difference. But mostly, I wanted to thank Dennis for bringing UPHClean to my attention. I've been having sloooow shutdowns for a long time and wondering what the heck was going on. I installed this program and now instant shutdowns! Thank You!

[davey]

Guest_Jim_*, on Jul 26 2008, 04:44 PM, said:

No, I am not doing secure deletion and I do not believe it is CCleaner causing this directly either, just that it starts something that then blocks the shutdown.
I did look at as many of the logs as I could and those two events are the only ones that matched up with the shutdown, all the others had to do with starting up. Perhaps the reason you could not replicate this is that your CCleaner settings are different than mine. I have attached my CCleaner settings, though I did got through and remove the cookies, include and exclude stuff as I am certain none of those should have any relation to the problem.
CCleaner.txt

From what I have seen here, I would guess that I am still naive when it comes to WinXP and the forums.
I have been advising some new users to be sure that they have UPHCLEAN installed and I figured it was old news anyway as far as the forum goes. IE6, Windows Defender and likewise Windows Live One Care were the biggest culprits in clogging up my User Profile Hive. It was this search for CLEANERS that lead me here to CCleaner and the forums from Wikipedia of all places.

Dennis bringing up the UPHCLEAN program made me think about all those slow processing hours with Live One Care being installed and running right along with Windows Defender. One day Windows Defender was up to around 340 MB and climbing when I finally had the guts to "End Process" on it.

Anyhow Jim, I think you were right-on about maybe a log file or something needed to be created. One of the biggest culprits in my book next to IE6 is Windows Defender.
I suggest that you turn off the option to clean Windows Defender and see how that affects the shutdown process.

If you did an upgrade from XP to Vista, I also suggest that you make sure UPHCLEAN v1.6 has been uninstalled and that you haven't installed UPHCLEAN v2.0 BETA.
Good Luck,
davey

[Guest_Jim_*]

Thanks davey, I just unchecked the Windows Defender option and my laptop shutdown without incident.

[Jamin4u]

This is why I hang out here at the Piriform Forums. I learn something new everyday.

I had never heard of the User Profile Hive before.

I have suggested using the process of elimination before to find a culprit. What I mean is to uncheck all but one section at a time. Run CCleaner, then enable the next section until you narrow it down to the one that is causing you the problem. It would have worked in this case had I thought of it.

But it looks as if davey got it with one shot.

Quote

I suggest that you turn off the option to clean Windows Defender and see how that affects the shutdown process.

Great Job,

Jamin4u

[YoKenny]

Jamin4u, on Jul 26 2008, 03:36 PM, said:

If you haven't already, I would look at the following category's in the Event Viewer.

1) Administrative Events
2) Application log
3) System log

Look for warnings and errors, before, during, and after shutdown.

I like

Quote

Analyze your event logs with Event Log Explorer™

Event Log Explorer™ is an effective software solution for viewing, monitoring and analyzing events recorded in Security, System, Application and another logs of Microsoft Windows NT/2000/XP/2003 operating systems. Event Log Explorer greatly extends standard Windows Event Viewer monitoring functionality and brings many new features.

http://www.eventlogxp.com

You can register for a Free for personal use code to prevent the startup nag.

[DennisD]

slowday444, on Jul 27 2008, 01:03 AM, said:

First of all, so this doesn't fall under the domain of hijacking, let me say I shutdown without CCleaning and with CCleaning prior to shutdown and there was no difference. But mostly, I wanted to thank Dennis for bringing UPHClean to my attention. I've been having sloooow shutdowns for a long time and wondering what the heck was going on. I installed this program and now instant shutdowns! Thank You!

Nice one, I'm pleased it worked for you. It certainly worked for me.

[davey]

DennisD, on Jul 26 2008, 04:55 PM, said:

I wonder if this little utility might help.
UPHClean:
I was experiencing "hanging" and occasionally "slow shutdown" some time ago, and this useful little program was recommended, and certainly helped.
It might be worth a look.

Yes Dennis, it is a good thing that you brought it up.

This slow log-off problem has caused many users problems and I just wanted to re-emphasize that this Service is the cure.
It was not on my PC when the computer was installed. It should be installed if you currently have the problem or not.
Check below to be sure that this applies to your PC.
UPHClean User Profile Hive Cleanup Service
This is an official Microsoft windows program.It should only be downloaded from Microsoft.

UPHClean: A service to help with slow log off and unreconciled profile problems.

Supported Operating Systems: Windows 2000; Windows Server 2003; Windows XP 32-Bit systems
(NOT FOR Windows VISTA) Windows Vista has it's own program DPHClean that comes installed with Vista.

UPHClean v1.6d does not function under Windows XP x64 Edition or Windows Server 2003 x64 Edition.
A future version of UPHClean may be supported under those operating systems.

Thanks for the advice,
davey